Confirming my understanding of a bunch of rules - Guild Wars Forums

Francis Crawford · Jan 10, 2006, 06:46 AM // 06:46

Most of these would be hard to find answers to via search. I apologize in advance for the exceptions.

1. I use Flare, which has a casting time of 1 second and no recharge time. Even so, it's not available immediately. This is because of a universal "cooldown" time for spells, right? And that's .75 seconds, right?

2. I use a staff that req 10 Water Magic. It has mods of Defense (+5) and Enchanting (20%). I don't actually have 10 ranks in Water Magic. So I get the benefit of the mods, but my weapon damage with the staff is pathetic. Right?

3. I'm using that staff, and getting the mods' benefit, and I cast Kinetic Armor (duration 8 seconds). However, I don't cast another spell in time to recharge. Kinetic Armor will last 9 seconds (9.6 seconds rounded down). Right?

Or can enchantment durations, unlike damage, be measured in fractional numbers? (They SHOULD be, I'd think ...)

4. I have a staff that lengthens the duration of enchantments, and a wand that improves recharge times on certain spells. So depending on what I'm casting, I should switch weapons. What matters is which weapon I'm holding when the spell FINISHES being cast, right?

5. I'm struggling to keep Kinetic Armor up, and it starts blinking, so I quickly cast a spell. That may not be good enough, however, because the spell has to FINISH being cast before the 8/9/9.6 seconds are up, right?

6. By the way, how long before it expires does an enchantment's icon start blinking?

7. Is a shield's benefit tied to the Tactics attribute the way a sword's damage is tied to the Sword Master attribute and a bow's damage is tied to the Marskmanship attribute?

Thanks in advance for your answers!!

adventchildren · Jan 10, 2006, 07:05 AM // 07:05

Let me try and Answer some of your questions.

For number 2, you still get the mod benefits of your staff/weapon even if you dont meet the attribute requirement.

For number 6, when the icon starts blinking it I would guess it goes out in about 4-5 seconds (but I dont know about that never counted)

For the last one, to the best of my knowledge yes they are all tied to their attribute lvls. So just like in number 2 you would still get the mod benefits but armor//dmg for shields and weapons would not start counting until you reached the required attribute lvl.

Wrath Of Dragons · Jan 10, 2006, 07:08 AM // 07:08

Confirming my understanding of a bunch of rules

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Most of these would be hard to find answers to via search. I apologize in advance for the exceptions.

1. I use Flare, which has a casting time of 1 second and no recharge time. Even so, it's not available immediately. This is because of a universal "cooldown" time for spells, right? And that's .75 seconds, right?
-----yes

2. I use a staff that req 10 Water Magic. It has mods of Defense (+5) and Enchanting (20%). I don't actually have 10 ranks in Water Magic. So I get the benefit of the mods, but my weapon damage with the staff is pathetic. Right?
----yes
3. I'm using that staff, and getting the mods' benefit, and I cast Kinetic Armor (duration 8 seconds). However, I don't cast another spell in time to recharge. Kinetic Armor will last 9 seconds (9.6 seconds rounded down). Right?
------yes. or maybe 10, im not sure which way it rounds
Or can enchantment durations, unlike damage, be measured in fractional numbers? (They SHOULD be, I'd think ...)
-------i dont think so. it has always seemed fairly exact
4. I have a staff that lengthens the duration of enchantments, and a wand that improves recharge times on certain spells. So depending on what I'm casting, I should switch weapons. What matters is which weapon I'm holding when the spell FINISHES being cast, right?
-------when you start the cast, not finish im almost certian
5. I'm struggling to keep Kinetic Armor up, and it starts blinking, so I quickly cast a spell. That may not be good enough, however, because the spell has to FINISH being cast before the 8/9/9.6 seconds are up, right?
-------should be start, not finish
6. By the way, how long before it expires does an enchantment's icon start blinking?
-------3 seconds i believe
7. Is a shield's benefit tied to the Tactics attribute the way a sword's damage is tied to the Sword Master attribute and a bow's damage is tied to the Marskmanship attribute?
-------the defence is linked, not the mods on the shield
Thanks in advance for your answers!!

Francis Crawford · Jan 10, 2006, 07:28 AM // 07:28

Thanks for the quick help!

The reason I've been thinking that the end of a spell's casting is the trigger is this experience:

If the Kinetic Armor icon starts blinking, and I cast a spell, I DON'T always get the enchantment to renew.

Also, frankly, it looks like a lot of the rules language resembles that in Magic the Gathering, where there's been a lot of tightening up of anomalies over the years. And in MtG, most things are triggered upon spell resolution.

Wrath Of Dragons · Jan 10, 2006, 07:48 AM // 07:48

hmmmm. now uv got me wondering lol

Antisocial · Jan 10, 2006, 08:04 AM // 08:04

The cast has to be completed, before kin armor ends, not just cast it, you have to complete it as well...

Rajamic · Jan 10, 2006, 08:28 AM // 08:28

Yeah, which is annoying when you get interrupted.

Also on #2, if you don't meet the requirement for damage on a staff, you also only get +3 energy from the basic boost all staves have, not whatever it has listed.

Former Ruling · Jan 10, 2006, 11:51 AM // 11:51

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rajamic

Yeah, which is annoying when you get interrupted.

Also on #2, if you don't meet the requirement for damage on a staff, you also only get +3 energy from the basic boost all staves have, not whatever it has listed.

This is incorrect.

The Energy on a Staff is NOT linked to the attribute requirement.

Only Offhand items have the energy linked to the level.

Auntie I · Jan 10, 2006, 01:20 PM // 13:20

Quote:

Originally Posted by Francis Crawford

Most of these would be hard to find answers to via search. I apologize in advance for the exceptions.

1. I use Flare, which has a casting time of 1 second and no recharge time. Even so, it's not available immediately. This is because of a universal "cooldown" time for spells, right? And that's .75 seconds, right?

If I recall correctly yes this is correct. I haven't used Flare in a while though and the Aftercast isn't as noticable otherwise/

Quote:

2. I use a staff that req 10 Water Magic. It has mods of Defense (+5) and Enchanting (20%). I don't actually have 10 ranks in Water Magic. So I get the benefit of the mods, but my weapon damage with the staff is pathetic. Right?

The damage a weapon will do is the base damage of the weapon type. 2-4 or 3-5 depending on the weapon type.

Quote:

3. I'm using that staff, and getting the mods' benefit, and I cast Kinetic Armor (duration 8 seconds). However, I don't cast another spell in time to recharge. Kinetic Armor will last 9 seconds (9.6 seconds rounded down). Right?

Correct. Guild wars rounds ALL fractions down. Don't know why, it just does.

Quote:

Or can enchantment durations, unlike damage, be measured in fractional numbers? (They SHOULD be, I'd think ...)

Why should they be? Nothing else is.

Quote:

4. I have a staff that lengthens the duration of enchantments, and a wand that improves recharge times on certain spells. So depending on what I'm casting, I should switch weapons. What matters is which weapon I'm holding when the spell FINISHES being cast, right?

I believe that this is correct. It's the completion of the spell that counts in this case. Since the length of the enchantment is calculated when it comes into existance not when you start to cast the spell. Recharging only starts after the spell is cast and so should work the same way.

Quote:

5. I'm struggling to keep Kinetic Armor up, and it starts blinking, so I quickly cast a spell. That may not be good enough, however, because the spell has to FINISH being cast before the 8/9/9.6 seconds are up, right?

Rightie O!

Quote:

6. By the way, how long before it expires does an enchantment's icon start blinking?

You know I don't know if anyone has ever checked this. Hmmmmmm. Project for tonight!

Quote:

7. Is a shield's benefit tied to the Tactics attribute the way a sword's damage is tied to the Sword Master attribute and a bow's damage is tied to the Marskmanship attribute?

The Shields "Armor" is tied to the requirement. Either Strength or Tactics.

Quote:

Thanks in advance for your answers!!

No problem!

dawnrain · Jan 10, 2006, 01:48 PM // 13:48

1. right.
2. Right.
3. Probably right. Not ALL fractions are rounded, escpecially fractions related to time. (See attack times for examples)
4. Probably right. (See interruption example above)
5. Probably right.
6. Don't know it always seems to fast for me to notice.
7. A sheild's benefit(s) are tied to the attributes/conditions listed next to the benefit. E.g. Armour: 16 (req 9 strength) - is tied to strength. Health + 45 (while enchanted) - is tied to being enchanted.

Francis Crawford · Jan 11, 2006, 02:43 AM // 02:43

OK. We seem to have a difference of opinion as to whether an enchantment can last a fractional number of seconds. Anybody else care to chime in with their informed guess? Thanks!

In other news, after experimenting with Ether Renewal for a while, I feel pretty sure that the energy cost of a spell is incurred when it is cast, but the benefits from Ether Renewal, Aura of Restoration, Fire Attunement, etc. only occur when the casting is complete.

I also discovered that moving or casting enough spell before the first one is finished causes the first one not to be successfully cast. It seems that the energy is spent, but the spell does NOT need to recharge. I presume the same may be true if one is knocked down.

Auntie I · Jan 11, 2006, 01:03 PM // 13:03

To clarify the fractions thing. Attack Times are hard coded into the game so of course they aren't rounded. Attack times are specific but any fractions resulting from a calculation are rounded down.

Energy cost is incurred at the start of the skill. The energy must be there in order to start a skill. The result of a skill doesn't start until the skill is cast.

Quote:

I also discovered that moving or casting enough spell before the first one is finished causes the first one not to be successfully cast. It seems that the energy is spent, but the spell does NOT need to recharge. I presume the same may be true if one is knocked down.

If you move you stop the cast which required you to be stationary for the length of the cast time. Since you did it and it wasn't caused by another player/monster there is no recharge.
I would class being knocked down as an interrupt. The skill does need to recharge if you get knocked down.

BTW I think the icons start blinking 3 seconds before they are going to end. I was just using my watch to time the seconds (and trying to stay alive at the same time) so I could be off a second. It didn't seem long enough to be 5 seconds though.

Jan 10, 2006, 06:46 AM // 06:46	#1
Francis Crawford Forge Runner Join Date: Dec 2005	Confirming my understanding of a bunch of rules Most of these would be hard to find answers to via search. I apologize in advance for the exceptions. 1. I use Flare, which has a casting time of 1 second and no recharge time. Even so, it's not available immediately. This is because of a universal "cooldown" time for spells, right? And that's .75 seconds, right? 2. I use a staff that req 10 Water Magic. It has mods of Defense (+5) and Enchanting (20%). I don't actually have 10 ranks in Water Magic. So I get the benefit of the mods, but my weapon damage with the staff is pathetic. Right? 3. I'm using that staff, and getting the mods' benefit, and I cast Kinetic Armor (duration 8 seconds). However, I don't cast another spell in time to recharge. Kinetic Armor will last 9 seconds (9.6 seconds rounded down). Right? Or can enchantment durations, unlike damage, be measured in fractional numbers? (They SHOULD be, I'd think ...) 4. I have a staff that lengthens the duration of enchantments, and a wand that improves recharge times on certain spells. So depending on what I'm casting, I should switch weapons. What matters is which weapon I'm holding when the spell FINISHES being cast, right? 5. I'm struggling to keep Kinetic Armor up, and it starts blinking, so I quickly cast a spell. That may not be good enough, however, because the spell has to FINISH being cast before the 8/9/9.6 seconds are up, right? 6. By the way, how long before it expires does an enchantment's icon start blinking? 7. Is a shield's benefit tied to the Tactics attribute the way a sword's damage is tied to the Sword Master attribute and a bow's damage is tied to the Marskmanship attribute? Thanks in advance for your answers!!

Jan 10, 2006, 07:05 AM // 07:05	#2
adventchildren Frost Gate Guardian Join Date: Oct 2005	Let me try and Answer some of your questions. For number 2, you still get the mod benefits of your staff/weapon even if you dont meet the attribute requirement. For number 6, when the icon starts blinking it I would guess it goes out in about 4-5 seconds (but I dont know about that never counted) For the last one, to the best of my knowledge yes they are all tied to their attribute lvls. So just like in number 2 you would still get the mod benefits but armor//dmg for shields and weapons would not start counting until you reached the required attribute lvl.

Jan 10, 2006, 07:08 AM // 07:08	#3
Wrath Of Dragons Burninate Stuff Join Date: Aug 2005 Location: New Mexico Profession: E/Mo	Confirming my understanding of a bunch of rules -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Most of these would be hard to find answers to via search. I apologize in advance for the exceptions. 1. I use Flare, which has a casting time of 1 second and no recharge time. Even so, it's not available immediately. This is because of a universal "cooldown" time for spells, right? And that's .75 seconds, right? -----yes 2. I use a staff that req 10 Water Magic. It has mods of Defense (+5) and Enchanting (20%). I don't actually have 10 ranks in Water Magic. So I get the benefit of the mods, but my weapon damage with the staff is pathetic. Right? ----yes 3. I'm using that staff, and getting the mods' benefit, and I cast Kinetic Armor (duration 8 seconds). However, I don't cast another spell in time to recharge. Kinetic Armor will last 9 seconds (9.6 seconds rounded down). Right? ------yes. or maybe 10, im not sure which way it rounds Or can enchantment durations, unlike damage, be measured in fractional numbers? (They SHOULD be, I'd think ...) -------i dont think so. it has always seemed fairly exact 4. I have a staff that lengthens the duration of enchantments, and a wand that improves recharge times on certain spells. So depending on what I'm casting, I should switch weapons. What matters is which weapon I'm holding when the spell FINISHES being cast, right? -------when you start the cast, not finish im almost certian 5. I'm struggling to keep Kinetic Armor up, and it starts blinking, so I quickly cast a spell. That may not be good enough, however, because the spell has to FINISH being cast before the 8/9/9.6 seconds are up, right? -------should be start, not finish 6. By the way, how long before it expires does an enchantment's icon start blinking? -------3 seconds i believe 7. Is a shield's benefit tied to the Tactics attribute the way a sword's damage is tied to the Sword Master attribute and a bow's damage is tied to the Marskmanship attribute? -------the defence is linked, not the mods on the shield Thanks in advance for your answers!!

Jan 10, 2006, 07:28 AM // 07:28	#4
Francis Crawford Forge Runner Join Date: Dec 2005	Thanks for the quick help! The reason I've been thinking that the end of a spell's casting is the trigger is this experience: If the Kinetic Armor icon starts blinking, and I cast a spell, I DON'T always get the enchantment to renew. Also, frankly, it looks like a lot of the rules language resembles that in Magic the Gathering, where there's been a lot of tightening up of anomalies over the years. And in MtG, most things are triggered upon spell resolution.

Jan 10, 2006, 07:48 AM // 07:48	#5
Wrath Of Dragons Burninate Stuff Join Date: Aug 2005 Location: New Mexico Profession: E/Mo	hmmmm. now uv got me wondering lol

Jan 10, 2006, 08:04 AM // 08:04	#6
Antisocial Academy Page Join Date: Sep 2005 Profession: W/Mo	The cast has to be completed, before kin armor ends, not just cast it, you have to complete it as well...

Jan 10, 2006, 08:28 AM // 08:28	#7
Rajamic Wilds Pathfinder Join Date: May 2005 Location: IA Guild: Chronicles of Heroes [CoH] Profession: R/Me	Yeah, which is annoying when you get interrupted. Also on #2, if you don't meet the requirement for damage on a staff, you also only get +3 energy from the basic boost all staves have, not whatever it has listed.

Jan 10, 2006, 01:48 PM // 13:48	#10
dawnrain Frost Gate Guardian Join Date: Nov 2005	1. right. 2. Right. 3. Probably right. Not ALL fractions are rounded, escpecially fractions related to time. (See attack times for examples) 4. Probably right. (See interruption example above) 5. Probably right. 6. Don't know it always seems to fast for me to notice. 7. A sheild's benefit(s) are tied to the attributes/conditions listed next to the benefit. E.g. Armour: 16 (req 9 strength) - is tied to strength. Health + 45 (while enchanted) - is tied to being enchanted.

Jan 11, 2006, 02:43 AM // 02:43	#11
Francis Crawford Forge Runner Join Date: Dec 2005	OK. We seem to have a difference of opinion as to whether an enchantment can last a fractional number of seconds. Anybody else care to chime in with their informed guess? Thanks! In other news, after experimenting with Ether Renewal for a while, I feel pretty sure that the energy cost of a spell is incurred when it is cast, but the benefits from Ether Renewal, Aura of Restoration, Fire Attunement, etc. only occur when the casting is complete. I also discovered that moving or casting enough spell before the first one is finished causes the first one not to be successfully cast. It seems that the energy is spent, but the spell does NOT need to recharge. I presume the same may be true if one is knocked down.